Necessary Messes, The Illusion Of Failure, & Letting Yourself Learn: A Conversation with Kate Sandel

Kate Sandel is back on the podcast! In less than a week’s time, Kate and I are co-teaching at a three-day clinic called Camp of the South, in Devon, UK. Initially we had the idea to record a conversation together to send to participants of the camp as a “here’s some helpful information” type spiel but it quickly became obvious that our chattering extended far beyond the limits of those three days to encompass the broader expectations we might have in learning environments, what it takes to be open to learning and what we consider to be “the best way to show up” as a student.

In this episode, we discuss:

🌷 What is takes to develop a “teachable mindset”

🌷 The necessary mess of the learning process (and how to embrace it)

🌷 How there is no such thing as failure

🌷The benefit of honesty and vulnerability in teaching environments

🌷 Discovering the joy (and challenge) of movement for both horses and humans

For those of you yet to discover the delight that is Kate Sandel, Kate runs a thriving equine business in the UK and internationally. She had trained for several years with French classical master, Philippe Karl, as well as honing her horsemanship skills with a variety of incredible teachers. She is also a qualified equine sports massage therapist and her background in mental health means she values the wellbeing of both humans and horses in a riding partnership.

You can find Kate at

Happy listening!

❤️ Jane

If I Run Out Of Brave…

​My littlest boy Tommy was off playing in the snow today. My husband, Giles, just sent me a message that he went on the ski lift for the first time, and sent a video of them high above the slopes.

How did he find it? I asked.

He replied, he was nervous to go but looked over and said to him, if I run out of brave, will you hold my hand?

And off he went.

That’s all we need sometimes, isn’t it?

Someone to hold our hand when we run out of brave.


❤️ Jane